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I find my K-Meleon 0.9 to very often trash it's cache. Is there a way to influence stability, or is this a known issue?
I'm on a rather slow dialup connection and a stable disk cache does noticeably accelarate loading of sites, I frequently visit. My Mozilla's cache is stable over weeks and months, whereas my K-Meleon is loading the same images again and again...
Hi KKO!
Hmm, it doesn't sound so much to me like K-Meleon is "trashing the cache" (emptying it) as much as it does that it's set to check each page every time you go back to visit it perhaps during a session? Or, maybe in "Privacy Plugin" you have it set to delete everything when shutting down and starting up? This would also "trash your cache".
Several things you can do here, okie?
First, go to "Edit/Preferences/Cache" and in the first box make sure that your memory cache is set to a rather high number. If you have the RAM for it then 65536 is a good number, or even something higher. But don't go, oh... ¾ of your RAM I would say. That would really slow you down! Set the second box, disk cache, to 102400. That's over 100megs---which may slow you down if you have a very fast processor? Balance it out and try ½ that amount perhaps?
Next, move down and click, "Once per session." This will mean that when you revisit a page during your browsing session it will just compare the URL to that in history and reload what's in memory---or disk.
Now, while in there go down to "Plugins" and click on that. Look for "Privacy Plugin". Click that and press the "Configure" button. A GUI box will come up, see? Look for "Disk Cache". If it's checked to clear that at either start-up or shut-down you can uncheck that, okie? This will keep the amount you've set your disk cache for opened and not emptied each time you open/close K-Meleon.
Next: Press "Ok", then "Ok" on the "Preference" box itself, restart the browser (remembering to shut down the Loader programme if you use that buggy thing!) and then restart---and voilà ! That should give you your desired results.
Hopefully. You can ALWAYS play around with those cache setting numbers I gave until you get what you think works best.
Best of luck!
Eyes-Only
"L'Peau-Rouge d'Acadie"
Thank you very much for your detailed explanation, Eyes-Only!
My settings are as follows (should have told that):
Memory cach: 13 MB, disk cache: 128 MB, cache comparison: automatically, privacy plugin: disabled. And I'm using that buggy thing!. Without the loader it would be even worse!
Hi KKO,
Hmm... Maybe then you should try a higher disc cache setting? If you are someone who browses a lot then 13MB may be way too small and when it reaches that 13MB it could be emptying back to 0MB? I'm not sure if KM empties to 0 or if it empties a little bit at a time? I can't recall Mozilla's behaviour in this regard.
You mentioned that you don't have this problem when surfing in Mozilla, ja? So what is the Mozilla disc cache set for? (I think that is "Edit/Preferences/Advanced/Cache" but I don't bother checking that as I deal with other settings in my Mozilla.) Perhaps you could try setting to that number? hehe! Now I can see you telling me, "But it IS set to that number!" In that case I say, "Where is Guenter or jsnj when I need them?" LOL!
The hard thing is if you set the disc cache too high then that will likewise slow down the KM as I noted above. -sigh-
Many have found though that KM, when set to "Once per session", as explained above, noticeably speeds up their browser. Too bad I couldn't run a fibre optic line to your machine to mine so you could run off my t2 connection.
I am curious about one thing KKO: I've never had the chance to speak with someone who has used the Loader before. Many of us have recommended against it because it really does have so many bugs. (It was nearly impossible to use it with 0.8.2 as it badly messed up the browser!) You do not experience problems with that? Many of us here would be more than interested to hear of your experiences with the Loader. And if you could include your OS as well we'd appreciate it. THANKS!
Amicalement mon ami! (And thanks for your help earlier!)
Eyes-Only
"L'Peau-Rouge d'Acadie"
http://eyes-only.dyndns.org/jimmymac/
I have the same settings, but much lower cache (only 1024KB and 51200K
, and don't have any problems.
The one flaw with the cache (and this has been brought up before) is that KM clears the cache when it doesn't shut down properly (ie, if it crashes or if you have to force it to shut down).
Ok, guys, let me summ up, what I know so far:
The cache management is a part of the GRE. So, it's nothing specific to K-Meleon. K-Meleon should behave as Mozilla, as far as the cache is concerned. What I have learned from Mozilla is, that the GRE seems to check the disk cache for consitency at program launch. If the cache data is somehow inconsistent, Mozilla will "trash" it's cache. This means, the "Cache" folder is emptied and a folder named "Cache.Trash" is created. This cache trashing usually happens when Mozilla has crashed. Or - it took me nearly one year to find that out! - when you defragment the "Cache" folder's host drive. Since I know that and do not defragment my cache drive any more, my Mozilla's cache is stable. I've set disk cache capacity to 128 MB (50 MB is the default). And memory cache capacity is set to 13 MB (Mozilla did that itself, it doesn't offer an option to change that like K-Meleon). I've set Mozilla to check cache data against network data automatically. These settings always worked fine. Therefore, - my dear wise friend, Eyes-Only - I took those settings over to K-Meleon...
My good old Intel 440BX working horse (Win2k, Pentium III 700MHz/FSB100 at 933MHz/FSB133 is a bit limited in memory/system bandwidth. Therefore, apllications are loading a bit slowly and I have chosen to use the K-Meleon loader. With the loader enabled, K-Meleon is launching even faster than Internet Explorer! And I haven't experienced any problems so far. Neither with 0.8.2 nor with 0.9. So I'm really curious about the guys recommending against it...
Because I do not want my cache (or anything else) to be deleted, I have never told my K-Meleon to do so. The privacy plugin is therefore redundant to me and I have disabled it. My prefs.js looks good, too.
As far as I've found out, the sequence of events is as follows:
- I log on, my cache folder is ok
- I run the loader, my cache folder is ok
- I go online and open a K-Meleon window, my cache folder is ok
- I open a web site in K-Meleon... and my cache is trashed!
Any suggestions?
PS: There is only one thing about the loader, that is a bit annoying: New windows always have the focus in the task bar, but they are frequently displayed in background (below existing windows)! But I can live with that...
Looks like I've finally tracked down the bug, comrades!
You were right, - my dear wise friend, Eyes-Only - the loader IS a buggy thing!
As far as I understand it now, the loader is not properly shut down by the Win2k user environment when I log off. I suppose the process is simply killed, because it is not (correctly) designed for Win2k/XP. This will of course have the same effect as if K-Meleon would have crashed: The disk cache is trashed!
The latter does not occur, when I manually exit the loader from the tray before I log off.
I suppose the loader has to be redesigned for Win2k/XP in order to perform it's "OnClose" method (in loader.cpp) automatically "OnLogOff" (if you feel what I mean. It would be interesting to know whether it works correctly under Win9X.
For now, as I see it, I have only the choice to either use the loader or to keep my disk cache... :´(
Wow! Thanks for all the observations on the Loader programme KKO! That's fascinating, though a bit hard for me to follow, but that's okie because I'm not a Dev, see?
It would be worth it if you would write ALL this information down and keep it in a *.txt file, safe somewhere on your computer, okie? And then to join the DevList (you can sign up for that on K-Meleon's mainpage at Sourceforge). Then when they actively pursue updating to the next version, be it 0.9.5, or 1.0, enter all this info to the DevList.
Yes, the Loader is buggy. However, Mozilla Suite (and SeaMonkey as well) has a type of Loader called "Quick Launch". We are still used on older computers and will be even when we go to v1.0. Having a corrected Loader, IMHO, would be a very valuable tool for our browser! Therefore, yes indeed, I believe it would be important that someone spend time fixing this so that it'll work properly!
You asked whether bugs are bad on 9x systems? Yes---and IMHO they are even worse than what you described! With 0.8.2 it would probably not just trash the cache (though no one reported this as we worked hard to clear it hehe!) but it would trash many important settings in the pref.js file, and occasionally in extreme cases, trash the browser and make it inoperable as well. We worked long and hard for many work arounds to transport settings to the User.js file as a "semi-patch" so users could still use it (I have forgotten them, memory problems).
Each update the problems with the Loader gets worse. I'd hate to think what it is like for 0.9. *shudder*
Again, thank you so much for all your diligent efforts and reporting! I really urge you to report this through official channels so that all this information is duly recorded and your efforts not lost.
Amicalement mon ami,
Eyes-Only
"L'Peau-Rouge d'Acadie"
This issue is now known as Bug 787.
Thank you, Eyes-Only, for encouraging me!
Salut, mon ami acadien!
(Ou acadienne? Mais non, il est un homme! Celle langue française, c'est très difficile...
De rien mon ami, je t'assûre! Et itou, merci mille fois que tu es suivi la faûte et placé un réport du bug sur ça pour la consideration des devs et la vérsion KM n°1.0!
Et ouais, c'est "akadien" car j'suis un vieux homme. Et ma langue n'est pas difficile. Pas de toute! Arabie, la langue de femme, ceci une langue si difficile mon ami! héhé!
Eh ben, c'est tout! Merci mille fois encore KKO! Sois-sage!
Amicalement,
Eyes-Only
"L'Peau-Rouge d'Acadie"
General discussion about K-Meleon. Questions about how to setup it, macro coding, all related to its usage and the project itself, including this website.
disk cache stability
Posted by:
kko
Date: July 13, 2005 08:21PM
I find my K-Meleon 0.9 to very often trash it's cache. Is there a way to influence stability, or is this a known issue?
I'm on a rather slow dialup connection and a stable disk cache does noticeably accelarate loading of sites, I frequently visit. My Mozilla's cache is stable over weeks and months, whereas my K-Meleon is loading the same images again and again...
Re: disk cache stability
Posted by:
Eyes-Only
Date: July 14, 2005 11:47PM
Hi KKO!
Hmm, it doesn't sound so much to me like K-Meleon is "trashing the cache" (emptying it) as much as it does that it's set to check each page every time you go back to visit it perhaps during a session? Or, maybe in "Privacy Plugin" you have it set to delete everything when shutting down and starting up? This would also "trash your cache".
Several things you can do here, okie?
First, go to "Edit/Preferences/Cache" and in the first box make sure that your memory cache is set to a rather high number. If you have the RAM for it then 65536 is a good number, or even something higher. But don't go, oh... ¾ of your RAM I would say. That would really slow you down! Set the second box, disk cache, to 102400. That's over 100megs---which may slow you down if you have a very fast processor? Balance it out and try ½ that amount perhaps?
Next, move down and click, "Once per session." This will mean that when you revisit a page during your browsing session it will just compare the URL to that in history and reload what's in memory---or disk.
Now, while in there go down to "Plugins" and click on that. Look for "Privacy Plugin". Click that and press the "Configure" button. A GUI box will come up, see? Look for "Disk Cache". If it's checked to clear that at either start-up or shut-down you can uncheck that, okie? This will keep the amount you've set your disk cache for opened and not emptied each time you open/close K-Meleon.
Next: Press "Ok", then "Ok" on the "Preference" box itself, restart the browser (remembering to shut down the Loader programme if you use that buggy thing!) and then restart---and voilà ! That should give you your desired results.
Hopefully. You can ALWAYS play around with those cache setting numbers I gave until you get what you think works best.
Best of luck!
Eyes-Only
"L'Peau-Rouge d'Acadie"
Re: disk cache stability
Posted by:
kko
Date: July 15, 2005 07:09AM
Thank you very much for your detailed explanation, Eyes-Only!
My settings are as follows (should have told that):
Memory cach: 13 MB, disk cache: 128 MB, cache comparison: automatically, privacy plugin: disabled. And I'm using that buggy thing!. Without the loader it would be even worse!
Re: disk cache stability
Posted by:
Eyes-Only
Date: July 15, 2005 05:01PM
Hi KKO,
Hmm... Maybe then you should try a higher disc cache setting? If you are someone who browses a lot then 13MB may be way too small and when it reaches that 13MB it could be emptying back to 0MB? I'm not sure if KM empties to 0 or if it empties a little bit at a time? I can't recall Mozilla's behaviour in this regard.
You mentioned that you don't have this problem when surfing in Mozilla, ja? So what is the Mozilla disc cache set for? (I think that is "Edit/Preferences/Advanced/Cache" but I don't bother checking that as I deal with other settings in my Mozilla.) Perhaps you could try setting to that number? hehe! Now I can see you telling me, "But it IS set to that number!" In that case I say, "Where is Guenter or jsnj when I need them?" LOL!
The hard thing is if you set the disc cache too high then that will likewise slow down the KM as I noted above. -sigh-
Many have found though that KM, when set to "Once per session", as explained above, noticeably speeds up their browser. Too bad I couldn't run a fibre optic line to your machine to mine so you could run off my t2 connection.
I am curious about one thing KKO: I've never had the chance to speak with someone who has used the Loader before. Many of us have recommended against it because it really does have so many bugs. (It was nearly impossible to use it with 0.8.2 as it badly messed up the browser!) You do not experience problems with that? Many of us here would be more than interested to hear of your experiences with the Loader. And if you could include your OS as well we'd appreciate it. THANKS!
Amicalement mon ami! (And thanks for your help earlier!)
Eyes-Only
"L'Peau-Rouge d'Acadie"
http://eyes-only.dyndns.org/jimmymac/
Re: disk cache stability
Posted by:
Drahken
Date: July 15, 2005 07:27PM
I have the same settings, but much lower cache (only 1024KB and 51200K
, and don't have any problems.The one flaw with the cache (and this has been brought up before) is that KM clears the cache when it doesn't shut down properly (ie, if it crashes or if you have to force it to shut down).
Re: disk cache stability
Posted by:
kko
Date: July 18, 2005 11:54AM
Ok, guys, let me summ up, what I know so far:
The cache management is a part of the GRE. So, it's nothing specific to K-Meleon. K-Meleon should behave as Mozilla, as far as the cache is concerned. What I have learned from Mozilla is, that the GRE seems to check the disk cache for consitency at program launch. If the cache data is somehow inconsistent, Mozilla will "trash" it's cache. This means, the "Cache" folder is emptied and a folder named "Cache.Trash" is created. This cache trashing usually happens when Mozilla has crashed. Or - it took me nearly one year to find that out! - when you defragment the "Cache" folder's host drive. Since I know that and do not defragment my cache drive any more, my Mozilla's cache is stable. I've set disk cache capacity to 128 MB (50 MB is the default). And memory cache capacity is set to 13 MB (Mozilla did that itself, it doesn't offer an option to change that like K-Meleon). I've set Mozilla to check cache data against network data automatically. These settings always worked fine. Therefore, - my dear wise friend, Eyes-Only - I took those settings over to K-Meleon...
My good old Intel 440BX working horse (Win2k, Pentium III 700MHz/FSB100 at 933MHz/FSB133
is a bit limited in memory/system bandwidth. Therefore, apllications are loading a bit slowly and I have chosen to use the K-Meleon loader. With the loader enabled, K-Meleon is launching even faster than Internet Explorer! And I haven't experienced any problems so far. Neither with 0.8.2 nor with 0.9. So I'm really curious about the guys recommending against it... Because I do not want my cache (or anything else) to be deleted, I have never told my K-Meleon to do so. The privacy plugin is therefore redundant to me and I have disabled it. My prefs.js looks good, too.
As far as I've found out, the sequence of events is as follows:
- I log on, my cache folder is ok
- I run the loader, my cache folder is ok
- I go online and open a K-Meleon window, my cache folder is ok
- I open a web site in K-Meleon... and my cache is trashed!
Any suggestions?
PS: There is only one thing about the loader, that is a bit annoying: New windows always have the focus in the task bar, but they are frequently displayed in background (below existing windows)! But I can live with that...
Re: disk cache stability
Posted by:
kko
Date: July 19, 2005 07:02PM
Looks like I've finally tracked down the bug, comrades!
You were right, - my dear wise friend, Eyes-Only - the loader IS a buggy thing!
As far as I understand it now, the loader is not properly shut down by the Win2k user environment when I log off. I suppose the process is simply killed, because it is not (correctly) designed for Win2k/XP. This will of course have the same effect as if K-Meleon would have crashed: The disk cache is trashed!
The latter does not occur, when I manually exit the loader from the tray before I log off.
I suppose the loader has to be redesigned for Win2k/XP in order to perform it's "OnClose" method (in loader.cpp) automatically "OnLogOff" (if you feel what I mean
. It would be interesting to know whether it works correctly under Win9X.For now, as I see it, I have only the choice to either use the loader or to keep my disk cache... :´(
Re: disk cache stability
Posted by:
Eyes-Only
Date: July 22, 2005 12:58AM
Wow! Thanks for all the observations on the Loader programme KKO! That's fascinating, though a bit hard for me to follow, but that's okie because I'm not a Dev, see?
It would be worth it if you would write ALL this information down and keep it in a *.txt file, safe somewhere on your computer, okie? And then to join the DevList (you can sign up for that on K-Meleon's mainpage at Sourceforge). Then when they actively pursue updating to the next version, be it 0.9.5, or 1.0, enter all this info to the DevList.
Yes, the Loader is buggy. However, Mozilla Suite (and SeaMonkey as well) has a type of Loader called "Quick Launch". We are still used on older computers and will be even when we go to v1.0. Having a corrected Loader, IMHO, would be a very valuable tool for our browser! Therefore, yes indeed, I believe it would be important that someone spend time fixing this so that it'll work properly!
You asked whether bugs are bad on 9x systems? Yes---and IMHO they are even worse than what you described! With 0.8.2 it would probably not just trash the cache (though no one reported this as we worked hard to clear it hehe!) but it would trash many important settings in the pref.js file, and occasionally in extreme cases, trash the browser and make it inoperable as well. We worked long and hard for many work arounds to transport settings to the User.js file as a "semi-patch" so users could still use it (I have forgotten them, memory problems).
Each update the problems with the Loader gets worse. I'd hate to think what it is like for 0.9. *shudder*
Again, thank you so much for all your diligent efforts and reporting! I really urge you to report this through official channels so that all this information is duly recorded and your efforts not lost.
Amicalement mon ami,
Eyes-Only
"L'Peau-Rouge d'Acadie"
Re: disk cache stability
Posted by:
kko
Date: July 29, 2005 07:13AM
This issue is now known as Bug 787.
Thank you, Eyes-Only, for encouraging me!
Salut, mon ami acadien!
(Ou acadienne? Mais non, il est un homme! Celle langue française, c'est très difficile...
Re: disk cache stability
Posted by:
Eyes-Only
Date: July 30, 2005 03:56AM
De rien mon ami, je t'assûre! Et itou, merci mille fois que tu es suivi la faûte et placé un réport du bug sur ça pour la consideration des devs et la vérsion KM n°1.0!
Et ouais, c'est "akadien" car j'suis un vieux homme.
Et ma langue n'est pas difficile. Pas de toute! Arabie, la langue de femme, ceci une langue si difficile mon ami! héhé!Eh ben, c'est tout! Merci mille fois encore KKO! Sois-sage!
Amicalement,
Eyes-Only
"L'Peau-Rouge d'Acadie"
English