I am currently using MyIE2 and am also interested in K-Meleon.

Two of the features I really like in MyIE2 are the "URL alias" and "groups."

Does K-Meleon have these two features? Thanks.

I don't think so. Or you have to do it with macros ... Believe me, like you i'm a MYIE2 user and if you are honest, you must say MYIE is, bar far, the best ! Only AvantBrowser is nearly as good as MYIE2.

To all readers . I'm not paid by the MYIE2 team.

a

berny:

The unofficial builds ( http://gratisDei.com/KM.htm ) of K-Meleon can do it (bookmark nickname & groupmark folder support), and the functionality is expected to be incorporated into the next official release (AFAIK).

I used to use MyIE2 (and before that, the original MyIE2, http://www.angelfire.com/nb/myie0/ , and before that the original MyIE ), and it does have alot of nice features (I especially liked the toolbar auto-hiding). All in all it is a very good browser. I believe that K-Meleon has a leg up on MyIE2, though, in a couple areas:

1. Macros: No other browser has a macroing system (not to my knowledge at least).
2. Gecko rendering engine: Standards compliant instead of being forced to use Microsoft's standards-mangling, as are browsers that use the IE rendering engine (a good example is the panels on the MyIE2 home page, which will not work in any other browser except IE).


Shelumi`El
Jordan

S.D.G

I appreciate the replies and I'll be looking forward to the next official release of
K-Meleon.

Well... What about :

1. allowing pop-up windows by a single clic
2. Re-open last (more than one if necessary) closed tab
3. Closing all tabs but the one that you are viewing
4. Protecting tab
5. Add URL in any subdirectory of Favorites with one click
6. Cleaning the cache + others after closing
7. Import/Export Favorites
8. Send page by Email

PS lease don't answer me that it's possible with macros: I've never understood how to deal with macro's ! What the users want (and believe me, i'm not alone in that case) is a program that does it all for you Au-TO-MA-TI-CA-LY ...

Yo m8, most of it is possible with macros, for point 3 just add

layers(CloseAllOther, &Close All Others)



in your menus.js-config under

LayerButtonPopup {

and under DocumentPopup if you like 2.

But I guess, the easiest solution for you should be:

"If you dont like it, dont use it!"

Cheers

I understand berny not being comfortable with macros and such. I'm not a programmer type either and for me, macros might as well be Esperanto written in cuneiform (although I am starting to look at them more thoughtfully now). The abstract layer of division between K-Mel being a cool small browser designed with a specific purpose and the whistles and bells that are seen as desireable by the general public is considerable. [please note: I may be biased since I live in a country where its deemed a good thing to drive a vehicle that needs a rear mounted camera to help you back up safely and instant-on seat warmers are a bonus feature in my region, despite the fact that it hasn't snowed more than one centimeter here since 1922]

Sometimes I think that the best choice would be for people to have a basic configuring tool to add do-kickeys themselves ("Roll your own bloatware" anyone?). Of course, that would be a seperate project and with limited resourcese to go around, yada-yada-yada... it would be the best of both worlds though.. we could call it a feature and then charge a premium... just kidding... put down the bag of padlocks... it was a joke... AAAYYIIIIIIHHH...!!!!

These might or might not work. Dunno, haven't tried.
Note: #3 seems to be the only one possible to be made without macros.

1) Can the plugin convert boolean values to integers automatically? Does "true" equal 1 or -1? Try removing the minus sign in the fourth line if this macro doesn't work.
popupToggle{
menu="Toggle popup behavior";
$pref="dom.disable_open_during_load";
$val=-(getpref(bool,$pref)+1);
setpref(bool,$pref,$val);
statusbar("Popup ".($val==0?"disabled":"enabled"));
}

2)
$lastClosed="";
openLastClosed{
open($lastClosed);
}
OnCloseWindow{
$lastClosed=$URL;
}

3) See Believer's post.

4) What's "protecting tabs"?

5) Can this be made? Help me; I'm not quite familiar with the bookmarks/favs plugin commands.

6) Planned for future versions.

7) KM don't need to import bookmarks/favs to use them. As for exporting, the best solutions is to use one of the many bookmarks/favs converters out there.

8) I've tried to implement this, but it just seems impossible to be made. Can attachments be specified in "mailto:" links? Even if they can, there's still a problem with the need to save the page first (thus displaying the "Save As" dialog, then asking the user for the filename...) since Gecko's cache is made difficult (or impossible) to read for security reasons.


Some random thoughts: When talking about a word processor, people generally will only think of typing, formatting text, printing, and a few small features. However, when they talk about a browser, different people have different things on their mind. That's why 'browser wars' are very typical (refer to KM vs then-Phoenix, IE vs Netscape, Gecko vs KHTML...). Therefore, it is very important to have a variety of choices. And we already have many choices now; from Netscape to Lynx, from OffByOne to Mozilla, from IE to Firebird, from... KM to MyIE2. Quoting Believer, "If you dont like it, dont use it!"

Please read the topic "Macro Help" . My ? is : Do you really want to do that to have a customized browse. I don't !

Just FYI...

Macroing languages are not "programming" as some recent posts have seemed to suggest, and they are not a burden either, as others have suggested. Macroing languages are extensible solutions for common tasks relating to their softwares.

The heirarchy is something akin to this:

assmebly code -> High-Level (HL) languages -> Object-Oriented (OO) languages -> scripting/macroing languages

Macroing is not an obfuscation of functionality; it is an exposing of functionality to end users, at run time, that would otherwise only be available "higher up on the hog" so to speak (e.g., in OO or HL languages, source level), at compile time.


Shelumi`El
Jordan

S.D.G

Here's my personal opinion.

JavaScript is programming. Macro is semi-programming.

The thread "macros help" should have been titled "javascript help", since most of it is done in JavaScript. Yea, it is likely able to be made a bookmarklet.

Now look at my macro #2. It's very simple. Yet, if you have to do the real "programming" (HL) for that, it's very complex. First, the variable $lastClosed should be declared global as it is used in more than one functions/procedures; Then, you need to handle the OnCloseWindow event to set the value of $lastClosed,.... You get the point.

Macros simplify those difficult tasks to only a few lines of code.

Yes, I know the difficulty still exists. But consider this. You know that the development pace of KM is very slow. The devs probably aren't even aware of the features other browsers have by the time they wrote the current version. And, alas, they probably are not interested in implementing those features for future versions (for the sake of the program's size and complexity).

In the meantime, what can we do? Sit back and accept the fact that our favorite feature isn't there? I don't think so. Grab the source and do the programming ourselves? You're kidding!

Macros give another option. If programming is too hard, why not create something semi-programmingly? Difficult? Yes; but not as difficult as doing the real programming.

There's always the last option of moving on to another browser that has solid devs who can implement those features. Again, quoting Believer, "If you dont like it, dont use it!"


@berny: It is very interesting that you stayed here and actually read our posts. Most people who didn't like KM just left messages saying, "KM sucks," and went away. Does this mean we can still convince you to use KM? :-)

Just a suggestion, if you're looking for another alternative browser, you can try Firebird. Uses the same rendering engine as KM (which is Gecko), but is relatively more feature-rich. You can configure your toolbars easily using it (so I heard).

Hi KM'ers
Snap just done the same. Been using MyIE2 for awhile in place of KM. I just gone back to KM. MyIE2 has great features but I kept shuddering at the thought of not having an open source browser, even felt guilty lol
Pleased to be back using KM now - missed it and roll on open source browsers and any browser web sites.

Any punishment? B gentle

encoderX
http://encoderX.co.uk

MonkeeSage,

Maybe you should post the macro reference doc on your site, I sent an updated doc to the mailing list a few weeks ago. Then whenever someone complains about the macros they can be pointed to the docs.


The macro facility, high configurability, and not having a lot of excessive gui bloat is what makes K-Meleon good.

asmpgmr:

Updated the old macro language reference page according to your text from the dev-list, added a link to it on the site (see the new section at the bottom).

Also, on an unrelated note, the bugs ref'd in the changes list are now linked to the bugtracker.


Shelumi`El
Jordan

S.D.G

What's the URL?

MonkeeSage,

You missed some stuff, I reposted the macro reference doc with a couple of more minor updates to the list.

I'm sorry but I don't use KM anymore. Why ?

1. The look of KM is not very nice even with skin.
2. Java is not well supported
3. Update are rare (ps: I use MYIE2 now and AvantBrowser : Avantbrowser have an update nearly every week...)
4. KM doesn't use alias like in MYIE2
5. When I type just a word (or more than one) in the adress bar of MYIE2 (let's say "madonna"), there is a Google search going on with "madonna" as keyword : can KM do that ?
6. Read

but most of all : I don't want to use macros : sorry but I don't understand how to do it.

@rmn : yes, I'm still interested in KM and I hope KM 0.8 will surprise me !

PS : Sorry for my English but it's not my mothertongue (It's French)

berny:

1. The look of KM is not very nice even with skin.

The same thing must be true about MyIE2, because about 1/2 of my skins are ported from MyIE2 skins (the other half are from Opera 7 skins) --
http://monkeesage.d2g.com/Skins.zip
http://monkeesage.d2g.com/new_skins.zip


2. Java is not well supported

K-Meleon has NO Java support -- JRE is incorporated by a set of Netscape plugins. The Gecko backend does all of the handling of Java, through the Netscape plugin architechture. The 1.2b version of Gecko is definitely buggy in this regard, but that is not a K-Meleon problem, per se (just like all of the IE vulnerabilities you can find listed on MSDN are not *MyIE2* security problems, they are problems with the backend software). Mozilla 1.2.1+ has fixed most of the Java problems.


3. Update are rare (ps: I use MYIE2 now and AvantBrowser : Avantbrowser have an update nearly every week...)

Updates are as often as you wish. K-Meleon is fully opensource, and so is Mozilla. You can make nightly builds if you want to. I usually keep my unofficial builds up to date with the latest beta Mozilla code (though I do not keep up with the nightlys).


4. KM doesn't use alias like in MYIE2

Planned for future releases / service packs, AFAIK (asmpgmr has submitted the patches for it already), and it is presently available in my unofficial builds.


5. When I type just a word (or more than one) in the adress bar of MYIE2 (let's say "madonna"), there is a Google search going on with "madonna" as keyword : can KM do that ?

Yes. You can also set it to search other places by default instead of google.

In defaults\pref\All.js:

pref("keyword.URL", "http://www.google.com/search?q=";
pref("keyword.enabled", true);


6. Read

but most of all : I don't want to use macros : sorry but I don't understand how to do it.

Nobody is forcing you to use them. In fact, you don't even have to load the plugin if you don't want to, let alone use it. Also, if you are interested, an updated macro reference is now listed here: http://gratisDei.com/macro-lang.html


Shelumi`El
Jordan

S.D.G

berny,

1. Try downloading a different skin, goto the resources section of this site. Frankly I don't see why people go on and on about the look of the top two bars (menu bar, toolbar/url bar) and the bottom status bar. It's web page content that matters.

2. Java is not really part of any browser, it's a separate add-on (and can also be a major security hole). Java comes bundled with the bigger browsers which makes for a bigger download. Anyway the support is in the underlying Gecko code.

3. So ?? Too many updates too often can sometimes lead to lots of bugs and bloat. Plus it is an open source browser so users are free to add features themselves though hopefully they will submit to the project runners to improve the browser.

4. I added this and it's in MonkeeSage's unofficial builds as well as some other useful features. You should try one of the unofficial builds.

5. Use a bookmark keyword / quicksearch alias or write a macro.

6. Well if you don't want to read the documentation then too bad, that's what the documentation is there for. If you're outright saying you don't want to read the documentation then you really have no right to complain.

MonkeeSage,

Couple of other things you missed in the updated macro reference doc:

In the statements list move the definition for the sub function after gsub to group them together logically. Also I added some text to gsub and sub explaining they're forms of gensub which also helps explain gensub.

In the plugin commands for macros list at the end under favorites add:
$nick = pluginmsgex(favorites, "FindNick", "NICKNAME", STRING);

5. When I type just a word (or more than one) in the adress bar of MYIE2 (let's say "madonna"), there is a Google search going on with "madonna" as keyword : can KM do that ?

I prefer my things on right click menu. As I use the browser on fullscreen. To do this all you is open menus.cfg in a txt editor and in the r.click menus areas put:
-
Search\tCtrl+G = ID_NAV_SEARCH

and as stated you can have it so it does it through your address bar.

Thats whats great about KM you can have (or not have) what you want. Also my 12 year old daughter begged me to put KM back on in place MyIE2 - that speaks volumes lol

encoderX
ICQ# : 82825922

The same thing must be true about MyIE2, because about 1/2 of my skins are ported from MyIE2 skins (the other half are from Opera 7 skins) --
]http://monkeesage.d2g.com/Skins.zip
]]http://monkeesage.d2g.com/new_skins.zip

Thanks MonkeeSage For the skins. I used a background and the 'K' avi throbber. I've put extra things on the right click menu I like.
I am so thankful to K-meleon for providing such a configurable browser the way I want a browser. It all looks super cool

encoderX
ICQ# : 82825922

encoderX:

Right on.

For me the difference between other browsers and K-M can be analogized using encoder-speak (hehe ); its kind of like the difference between using Windows Media Encoder or using Avisynth/Vdub...when you don't want someone else picking your keyframe interval, which streams to mux, &c., the latter is the only way to go.

Nice site, BTW!


Shelumi`El
Jordan

S.D.G

Thank you for your comments on my site. Appreciated.

I compare browsers very simply. You either have a browser where your at the mercy of the developers OR you have a browser that you can have the way you want it.

With K-meleon: everyone can have a browser the way they want it. Altering the menus, browser ID, toolbar...etc. are easy if you just ask and or try.
K-meleon has a forum for help and there's plenty of resources if you want them plus there's pre-done skins, throbbers, macros...etc.. Even these can be alter to suit yourself and or just pick the bits you like and add to your already personal browser creation. A very highly versatile and usable browser.

I understand not everyone wants a personal browser but, I (and thousands of others) sure do and appreciate the ability to be able to.

I love KM. I am not a programmer or all that computer literate but I love a puzzle. I hate bloat and I love to roll-my-own. You guys offer lots of help and ideas that I'm not going to get from the "big" boys. I love simple and if that mean two mouse clicks that's fine with me. The help I get in this forum is priceless. Yes, I work with the macros and .js files and when I can get them to do what I want, I feel great. KM is not for people that want it all just given to them. You don't just download KM, you build it!

You can keep it simple or build it to your needs. It's great. Thanks guys.

Walt