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Hi!
Posted by: MXB
Date: April 19, 2011 11:47AM

Hi, I started using Chameleon ;-) today. Works fine. My first (and favourite) browser was LYNX, then I used Arachne, then IE3-6 (until I realized I was actually using Windows a fair bit and had better be careful about the browser) then Firefox 1.5, then Opera and now I've found you guys. I no longer use IE. But the rest yes. :) Also Off by One which is even more lightweight a browser than this is. Fits on a floppy disk.

I avoided downloading this browser at first because it said I might need updated stuff for W98 but it turned out to not need anything. Guess it was installed already.

What prompted me was the fact that Opera is so slow with flash that Youtube doesn't work well. Firefox does but I get those irritating messages from the upgrade dorks at YT. K-M does YT very nicely.

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: guenter
Date: April 19, 2011 09:17PM

To turn off K-Meleon's update checker go F2 -> K-Meleon Plugins before it falls in disgrace as an "update dork". grinning smiley

p.s. The K-Meleon 1.5.4 installer ships the VC 7.1 dlls that are needed for Win98...

You'll find flash plugin for win 98 and such stuff on the extension pages.

http://kmext.sourceforge.net/ Install with an extension manager.

http://extensions.geckozone.org/K-MeleonEn Install with fire and forget installer - but has fewer extensions.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/19/2011 09:21PM by guenter.

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: MXB
Date: April 24, 2011 01:43AM

Quote
guenter
To turn off K-Meleon's update checker go F2 -> K-Meleon Plugins before it falls in disgrace as an "update dork". :D

I don't think I need fear KM's new versions yet... not until it stops working in Win98. Then I'll do as you say. :)

Quote
guenter
p.s. The K-Meleon 1.5.4 installer ships the VC 7.1 dlls that are needed for Win98...
You'll find flash plugin for win 98 and such stuff on the extension pages.

Ahh I kind of suspected that, I caught a glimpse as they were installed and thought, hmm might be the libraries. :)

Flash worked right off actually, no fuss no muss. It was installed for the previous browsers and I guess KM found the plugin automatically.

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: guenter
Date: April 24, 2011 04:05AM

Quote
MXB
It was installed for the previous browsers and I guess KM found the plugin automatically.

AFAIk when You choose install as Mozilla-Product or so it set the registry keys & does get info to find centrally installed browser plugins.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/24/2011 04:07AM by guenter.

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: siria
Date: April 24, 2011 05:00PM

Hi MXB smiling smiley
Off by One? Uh oh... grinning smiley Am also a fan of ultratiny and simple proggies, and actually used OB1 a couple times a few years ago, just for fun, but today it can't render hardly anything in a decent readable way anymore. Oh well. Just a couple years too outdated now ;-)

As it happens, my main machine is also running on win98(SE) and it's my only one that's online smiling smiley Am mighty glad that KernelEx allows me to also use some XP-proggies on that machine, especially also KM1.6, otherwise I'd started running into serious problems soon, seeing that more and more websites are coded for newer browsers only - uff!

But Youtube is real funny: With KM we're used that some stupid website coders don't check for their visitors browser 'engine' (same Gecko in FF and KM alike), but only for browser 'names' (FF different from KM), and then kick us out claiming KM were 'not supported', although it renders their stuff the same way as the FF version with the matching gecko version does. So on such sites we fake the user agent string in KM and make it claim it were a FF. Works fine cool smiley But on youtube it's exactly the other way around: They have decided to block FF2.x yet to allow KM1.5x in, just based on their names! Can't help thinking that must be some intentional thing, but anyway, if you fake the user agent string in FF2 to claim to be a KM browser, you could probably get in with FF too! But haven't tried yet, just an assumption ;-)



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/24/2011 05:04PM by siria.

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: MXB
Date: April 25, 2011 05:12AM

Yeah OB1 is a little limited on some sites. But since it never did javascript one can't complain! :)

Thanks for the tip about YT! (Edit: Wow, it works, FF1 now pretends to be K-M hehehe) One minor point is I'm using FF1 not FF2! :-D I, for some reason I've forgotten, decided not to install FF2. In any case I'm quite impressed with KM so it's a keeper and will replace FF1 I suppose. It's really quite amazing that I could set up KM to access my antique IE favourites, my FF1 bookmarks and my current Opera bookmarks.

I wonder what would happen if I saved any changes to these files in KM? I've avoided that for fear of corrupting them.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/25/2011 05:35AM by MXB.

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: guenter
Date: April 25, 2011 05:51AM

Quote
MXB

One minor point is I'm using FF1 not FF2! :-D I, for some reason I've forgotten, decided not to install FF2. In any case I'm quite impressed with KM so it's a keeper and will replace FF1 I suppose.

It's really quite amazing that I could set up KM to access my antique IE favourites, my FF1 bookmarks and my current Opera bookmarks.

I wonder what would happen if I saved any changes to these files in KM? I've avoided that for fear of corrupting them.

1.) The Linux folks maintained FF2 well past its official life time.
A past/last Windows compilation of FF 2 is at dhost.info.

It contains some minor changes and is a firefox 2.0.0.22. So two versions past/younger than the official. grinning smiley It is modular (no big exe); I needed one specific dll & an xpt of it. It is not intended to fone home. tongue sticking out smiley I am not sure whether it would try though. sad smiley

& Its real purpose was to allow GRE cross checks of buggy pages to compare with K-Meleon 1.5.4.

2.) My guess it was less effort to code native support than to code a migration tool. grinning smiley


3.) Bookmarks. K-Meleon knows classic Netscape bookmarks 100% IMHO. Read & write.

Cave: K-Meleon damages icons in bookmarks.html. But that Firefox feature/extension was AFAIK added for FF 2 or later?

IE Favorites are safe ground. Read and write.

But I would not allow K-Meleon to write much to the original Hotlist files.

IMHO siria found some valid buggs with the hotlist plugin. If You manage hotlist folders data can be lost. So don not with K-emelon. There might be more trouble hidden? siria can probably remember & tell some more details.

You can easily copy the hotlist to another place & set K-Meleon to use that, if You want to have a copy to write and manage with K-Meleon.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/25/2011 05:55AM by guenter.

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: siria
Date: April 25, 2011 07:00AM

Hihi, too cool that yt really works with that fake name, LOL! grinning smiley

Ah yes, hotlist, I use it quite a lot, so just from memory: NEVER try to add new folders or hotlist-bookmarks (how to call that??) by clicking Hotlist>Edit and right-clicking directly on the TOP folder! It will look working right at first, but next time you open it, the new entry or folder has vanished. If you moved other entries into such a new top folder, it's all gone. The workaround is to right-click on one of the lower folders or entries, to create new ones. Funnily, they will be created on the same level, not lower.
And Bug-2, if you switch to KM1.6beta, better replace the "hotlist.dll" with the version from KM1.5.4, since otherwise all your "Nicks" will get deleted.
It's not likely those bugs will get fixed anytime soon, guess the hotlist is at the very bottom of the priority list, seeing that no one (except me?) seems to use it, and there are far more urgent issues to fix.

Still, just make a backup copy of "opera.adr" in your profile folder (or elsewhere), before using the hotlist in KM, and you're on the safe side, and can try out whatever smiling smiley
Same for your bookmarks file. They seem to be a little bit touchy sometimes.
Really, it's highly recommended to keep a backup copy of at least the profile folder, and better yet, the whole KM-folder in programs. That gives you all freedom to experiment the wildest things and mess everything without risk grinning smiley (speaking from own experience cool smiley)

But favorites are rock-stable, no copy needed smiling smiley
Unlike bookmarks and hotlist the favorites have an own file for each entry, and I never had any trouble with them.
Just make sure in the options to choose in which folder new favorites will drop. That's the only drawback, while adding new ones KM doesn't ask anything, just drops them in that folder. Therefore highly recommended to use one of the additional favorites macros, which open a dialogue while adding new ones, for renaming and choosing folders smiling smiley
Personally I'm still very happily using kko's ancient macro that calls the native IE-AddFavorite-dialogue (or some such, if I got that right), but had to update the code myself, and due to that direly missed 'refresh menu' function in the favorites.dll, always hesitated to post it. That means, if you add a new favorite with this macro, it will be added okay, no worry, but the favorites list display in KM only gets updated if that native "toss in default folder" function is automatically called too afterwards. That's the problem for all such fav macros. For mine (kko's) version I decided on a workaround to set a non-existing zombie folder as default: First this optional macro adds the new favorite for real, then the native KM command adds it again to the default folder and thus refreshes the list display. Catch is, if a user forgets this and sets a real existing folder as default, he'll end up with double entries if he uses this macro *rolleyes* If I remember right, the other macros try to solve that dilemma by sending a delete command after each double entry, that works too. Just personally am too wary with automatic delete actions, just don't trust fully :-/

Oh well, I use all three systems simultaneously: Hotlist was first intended for some "quick and dirty" bookmarks, but have since grown to a few hundred, oops. Very handy are the nicks, am using them on folders and for search engines ("g" for google etc.). Otherwise the hotlist plugin is extremely outdated and very basic, pity. Unlike "bookmarks", discovered that too late. Use those now mainly for a few bookmarklets, and therefore they are set to open in the same page. And Favorites are still my main system, but were badly neglected for years, when I used only that native KM adding-function which tossed new ones all into one big messy heap :-(

Oh well, I know this sounds all very complicated, but considering your computer history, you're probably used to quite some manual configurations cool smiley ;-)

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: MXB
Date: April 26, 2011 08:08AM

Thanks guys! Lots of food for thought there. It is a pity indeed that the Hotlist (Opera) is not quite reliable since the 3 sets are in fact 3 ages of the same bookmarks. The Opera ones are the current ones which were imported from the FF ones which in turn were imported Favourites. I guess I'd best either make a seperate copy of the Opera bookmarks or just not modify them from K-M. Since I'd rather not have them diverge from another I probably should stick with not modifying them. I think too I'll backup the FF1 bookmarks and try playing with them since K-M is basically a replacement for FF1. If anything goes wrong I'll make a seperate copy for K-M and start with that instead. I suppose that's the way to import bookmarks for K-M.

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: guenter
Date: April 26, 2011 10:42PM

Quote
MXB
since the 3 sets are in fact 3 ages of the same bookmarks. The Opera ones are the current ones which were imported from the FF ones which in turn were imported Favourites.

Do export Opera Hotlist as html. I just checked & Opera can do that.

That gives You AFAIK the old fashioned and original Netscape bookmarks.
That is IMHO the exact file format that K-Meleon uses as bookmarks.html. grinning smiley

BTW. IE and Firefox can also export as HTML (the old Netscape format).

Old bookmarks.html can in turn be bookmarked or renamed and bookmarked.
Like all html files. smiling smiley I use old renamed topical bookmarks.html as link collections linked by my active bookmarks.html. The old ones are rarely changed unlike the current ones.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/26/2011 10:42PM by guenter.

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Re: Hi!
Posted by: MXB
Date: April 27, 2011 02:09AM

Yep, I already tried that, bookmarked the FF1 bookmarks.html and it shows up as a web page (off disk). What I couldn't manage was to get it to import the links as bookmarks automatically.

Right now I'm trying out a copy of the FF1 bookmarks.html which I did let K-M modify (thus I presume altering the header from generated by FF to by K-M and making it "native", as you say they're just html :) )

I could do a lot of work with my old bookmarks and merge them all as html but I figure it's OK as is. I don't really wanna get started down that road because then there's my bookmarks on my Win 95 computer and the Arachne bookmarks on my 386 and my old UNIX bookmarks from Lynx... I figure I better let them rest in peace! 8-D

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