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Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 08, 2010 12:21PM

A few minutes ago something happened that has made me nearly incapable of communicating. I can't begin to tell you how sick I am.

I had downloaded the newest K-meleon browser and it was not functioning properly after installation so I decided to uninstall it. When I did, it uninstalled more than half the programs and files on my computer before I could get it to shut down.

If anyone can help, PLEASE let me know right away. Thanks.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: SoerenB
Date: July 08, 2010 02:26PM

Quote

so I decided to uninstall it. When I did, it uninstalled more than half the programs and files on my computer

Hi, Dara,

We need much more info to help:

How did you do the uninstalling?
How did you realize "it" was uninstalling more than K-Meleon?
What was it that made you believe K-Meleon did this?
How did you "get it to shut down."
Could you boot, again, after that?
Which K-M version?
Which Windows version?
Some examples of "programs and files" "it" uninstalled?
Which browser were you using to post in this forum?

Cheers
SoerenB

KM 1.74b4u1 in Wine 1.6 on Linux Mint 17 (XFCE)
- and still being surprised every day
how easily all of this works ...

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 10, 2010 07:12AM

How did you do the uninstalling? Used the uninstall program provided by K-M.

How did you realize "it" was uninstalling more than K-Meleon? Looked at uninstall progress box when I thought it was taking too long and saw the listed programs being rapidly deleted.

What was it that made you believe K-Meleon did this? I saw it happening with my own eyes--saw the listed programs and files being deleted as shown in the delete progress box.

How did you "get it to shut down." Kept clicking on the "X" in the upper right-hand corner of the uninstall box. Then I think I finally used the Windows task manager.

Could you boot, again, after that? Yes, no problem.

Which K-M version? Newest stable version K-Meleon 1.5.4 (2010-03-05)
Which Windows version? XP (service pack 3) 2007

Some examples of "programs and files" "it" uninstalled? OpenOffice.org 3, Excel, PowerPoint, Incredimail, AdAware, et al, et al, et al. Can't afford to replace all these.

Which browser were you using to post in this forum? IE8

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: siria
Date: July 10, 2010 02:37PM

More: Where exactly did you download that KM-version?
And could it be that later you downloaded somewhere a program that infects other programs uninstall routines with a hidden virus...?
Personally I know only very little about antivirus stuff, but when did you run a last check, and whith what program? Do you happen to have some expert at hand who could examine your computer...? :-/

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: mhf
Date: July 10, 2010 08:21PM

...and just to make sure : where did you install KM..?

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: SoerenB
Date: July 10, 2010 10:22PM

... and, just to make sure "it" did not just delete StartMenu/Quickstart/Desktop shortcuts, leaving alone the programs proper:

click:

Start
Search
Search for Files and Folders

Type "soffice.exe" into the search field (no quotes)

in the "Search in" box, select "Local Harddisks"

Click:
Search Options
tick: "Advanced Options" (note: my windows is german - some wordings MAY be slightly different)

tick:
Search System Folders
Search hidden Elements
Search subfolders

Then click "Search Now"

If a soffice.exe IS found, chances are, all your programs are still there, you just lost the shortcuts. In that case, almost any neighbours' 16-year-old should be able to recreate them - or show you how to do it yourself.

Quote

Can't afford to replace all these.

Well, you still OWN the licenses, if you acquired them legally - no need to buy new ones! (concerning, at least, OpenOffice.org 3: that is free, anyway)

Cheers
SoerenB

KM 1.74b4u1 in Wine 1.6 on Linux Mint 17 (XFCE)
- and still being surprised every day
how easily all of this works ...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2010 10:23PM by SoerenB.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: guenter
Date: July 10, 2010 11:16PM

Calm down. You made a mistake or had an accident. Nothing should be lost except some time. Erasing does not totally delete data right away. It merely makes them invisible and allows Your system to use the space they occupy.

Quote
mhf
...and just to make sure : where did you install KM..?

That is IMHO exactly the question.


The deinstaller prompted/warned You: can I uninstall ...
Most uninstall.exes delete the files in their folder!

Now if You have had installed K-Meleon into a root folder instead of its own program folder and clicked away that warning.... sad smiley

In this case. Use an unerase program if essential data are missing.
http://www.google.de/search?q=free%20unerase%20program

The programs do not matter much, that is just an annoying waste of time. You own the licences and have the setup files, reinstall them. Programs like Belarc Advisor
may even help to retrieve license data from the registry. So that You have less to search.
http://www.google.de/search?hl=de&q=belark+advisor&btnG=Suche&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&oq=&gs_rfai=

Else do a virus scan like siria also seems to think is needed.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/11/2010 12:31AM by guenter.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: siria
Date: July 10, 2010 11:56PM

Quote
guenter
Quote
mhf
...and just to make sure : where did you install KM..?

That is IMHO exactly the question.
The deinstaller prompted/warned You: can I uninstall ...
Most uninstall.exes delete the files in their folder!
Now if You have had installed K-Meleon into a root folder instead of its own program folder and clicked away that warning.... sad smiley

Oh...!!! surprised smiley Now I see... And that would explain all of course, but if that's the case, uh oh... surprised smiley
Just to check I downloaded a setup file again and started it, and in fact, if I don't accept the first suggestion but "browse" to choose another folder, then there's no new suggestion for "selectedfolder\K-Meleon\", but only "selectedFolder\". Must admit, although that's basically correct, but that really takes a rather attentive user to not fall into the trap and click away...
IMHO it would be much safer to automatically add "K-Meleon\ to the chosen folder, just as new suggestion, which of course the user could delete again if he really knows what he's doing! Most programs I know do it that way, and one quickly gets used to chose e.g. "c:\myprogs\" and then just hit OK, and then expects all programs to work the same way. Just chose the parent folder and hit okay...

Sure, when later uninstalling, there would probably come the question "do you really want to uninstall c:\programs\ ?" or such, and there all my alarm bells would ring, but if one is half asleep or is used that everything works best if he simply keeps clicking away, and therefore doesn't read closely anymore, a mistake quickly can happen and the disaster is there...

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: guenter
Date: July 11, 2010 01:23AM

If a user does not know what is going on - he/she should use defaults.
They are chosen foolproof.

The remaining options give experienced users the opportunity to do their own thing.
I would probably not be here or not using the installer if it tried to overrule my decisions. The installer is IMHO no nanny to care for every eventuality.

p.s. When You change install locations it is IMHO best to use the input field in an old fashioned way and manually edit it actively instead of giving system or chance a possibility to play tricks with You grinning smiley

Du brauchtest nicht den ganzen Schmutz neu, die Installer funzen alle etwa gleich. Und nen Uninstaller kannst du in nem Temp Verzeichnis mal auf Wirksamkeit prüfen grinning smiley



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/11/2010 01:33AM by guenter.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 11, 2010 04:47AM

I downloaded it from the K-M site, installed it, tried it out and then uninstalled it. I did not download anything else during that time. I have more than adequate virus protection on my pc and from my ISP provider which I check every day.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 11, 2010 04:48AM

I installed it in its own folder in Program Files on my hard drive.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 11, 2010 04:53AM

I did all that and more immediately when I saw what had happened--am still scavenging around right now. As for the licences, some of these programs were so old I don't know if the licences will still work, eg., Excel and Powerpoint. I've alread downloaded the new Office. org 3 program. It was while this program was being deleted that I discovered what was happening. Only parts of it were lost but they were essential.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 11, 2010 04:57AM

The deinstaller prompted/warned You: can I uninstall ...
Most uninstall.exes delete the files in their folder!


It did that very cleanly and much more. You may be right that I can probably restore most of the programs but that thing ate up some private files whish is what's upsetting me most.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 11, 2010 05:02AM

but if one ...is used that everything works best if he simply keeps clicking away, and therefore doesn't read closely anymore, a mistake quickly can happen and the disaster is there...

This may be what happened. The more I think about it the more likely that may be. I always try to be very attentive to downloads and installations/uninstalling but may have had a momentary lapse and as you say, there's the disaster.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 11, 2010 05:08AM

I'm pretty sure I know what I'm doing in the case of these types of things most of the time but maybe something did get by me. However, why isn't it possible that there was something wrong with the uninstaller as there was with the program after it had been installed?

"Du brauchtest nicht den ganzen Schmutz neu, die Installer funzen alle etwa gleich. Und nen Uninstaller kannst du in nem Temp Verzeichnis mal auf Wirksamkeit prüfen" I guess so.confused smiley My kids were the German students but my language areas of study were Latin, French and Spanis.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 11, 2010 05:13AM

Just want to thank you all for all your generous help. I really appreciate it.

From my posts you can see that I failed to click the "quote" button most of the time so I hope you can make sense of my replies. That sort of thing (forgetting to click on an important option) may be just what caused my disaster.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: siria
Date: July 11, 2010 06:17AM

Quote
Dara
However, why isn't it possible that there was something wrong with the uninstaller as there was with the program after it had been installed?

Well, personally I doubt that for the simple reason that otherwise the forum would be full with complaints ;-)
Unless perhaps, some very rare combination of some settings or programs or drivers whatever... Although I can't quite imagine what could be so complicated in a uninstaller, figuring it just contains some short commands to delete a program folder and profile folder, along with a few shortcuts... Yes there are some more intrusive programs out there, but I don't think KM belongs to them, or it wouldn't be so easy to install. Just download it as a zip file, unzip and it's ready, without any further "installation stuff", and from what I read in this forum from more experienced people KM intentionally is kept quite simple.

Well, whatever the reason, truly sorry for your trouble!!
I suppose you don't feel like reproducing it, to figure out whether it was the uninstaller's fault or a little user glitch ;-) *kidding*
But hmm, since the 'uninstall' was interrupted, perhaps you can still find some trace of the path where it was installed, a shortcut not yet deleted, or perhaps search the registry for some entry containing K-Meleon...? (MRU or such)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/11/2010 06:42AM by siria.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: HTH
Date: July 11, 2010 10:21AM

Could system restore help Dara?

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/306084

I've never used it but you are supposed to be able to undo a restore.
I don't know what would happen to the now hidden data on the disk, tho.

HTH

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Doon
Date: July 11, 2010 02:56PM

Summarizing what might have happened: Some installers remove only the files they originally installed while others remove everything in the program folder. Perhaps KM is the latter kind and perhaps in this case KM was accidentally installed into the root of the Program Files folder and when it was uninstalled it tried to take everything with it.

Such things have apparently happened before:
quick example 1
quick example 2


In the absense of a total data backup to restore things the best procedure in cases like this is to immediately stop all activity on the PC and use some data recovery/undelete software (as Guenter suggested) to try to recover the lost files. Because, all activity on the hard drive after a deletion risks overwriting or corrupting the deleted files bit by bit, acting quickly will reduce this loss. It's best to launch such software from a location external to the hard drive, such as a USB drive, again to avoid file corruption.

Free tools that accomplish this are generally easy to find and use and everyone should be prepared with such utilities and knowledge for times like these.

Recuva is a free, small and simple possibility: Recuva

PC Inspector File Recovery is another: File Recovery 4.x

(I can mention those two because they both support Win98 [Recuva with v1.31])

Similar utilities may be found here: Snapfiles.com (data recovery)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/13/2010 11:27AM by Doon.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: siria
Date: July 11, 2010 04:40PM

Interesting stuff and links, thanx Doon!
Actually that scenario found by mhf and guenter was so outlandish to myself, I would never have guessed it, somehow expecting that KM would always create its own folder somehow. Oops.

Thinking about it again... When I uninstall something it usually asks "Do you really want to uninstall program XY?" My old machine doesn't usually ask for a folder to delete IIRC. But no idea, perhaps other systems do that... And *perhaps* they may check back if a system folder like "programs" gets a delete command, but in my case all programs are in a customized folder, which wouldn't automatically be considered anything special :-/

Haven't read through all your links yet, but this quote looks like a perfect compromise to me:

Quote
aptana-site
recent updates (2009-10-29) by mxia titled "Delete the subdirectories individually instead of deleting the whole installation dir at once. "

Along of course with always adding a "K-Meleon" folder after a user browsed for a new parent folder, just as a suggestion in the path line, which the user could remove again manually.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/11/2010 04:58PM by siria.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: mhf
Date: July 11, 2010 05:11PM

yes, and to add to what HTH and others said : when disaster strikes the first thing to do is STOP whatever you're doing and think.

For me the very best solution is to go back to a restore point - this has saved me so many times. I won't go into the discussion about which of images or restore points are better - it seems that that's a matter of taste.

I use FarStone DriveClone pro - it's not free but again it's saved me "life" so many times. You can of course use the inbuilt Windoze restore point but that has limitations.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: Dara
Date: July 12, 2010 10:46AM

Good grief! It's been so long since I've used a restore point and I was so frazzled and dumbfounded I couldn't and didn't think to use it. Hopefully, in the future if I need it, I will remember it.

I am still wondering why, when I had K-M installed in its own folder in the program files on my hard drive that it uninstalled others from there, too. However, I guess it's not of much concern any longer as little by little I've been reinstalling some programs and will just have to learn to live without some others.
My husband wryly said, though I really disagreed with him (because I didn't think I could function without the missing programs), that maybe now my pc will operate more smoothly.


Quote
mhf
yes, and to add to what HTH and others said : when disaster strikes the first thing to do is STOP whatever you're doing and think.

For me the very best solution is to go back to a restore point - this has saved me so many times. I won't go into the discussion about which of images or restore points are better - it seems that that's a matter of taste.

I use FarStone DriveClone pro - it's not free but again it's saved me "life" so many times. You can of course use the inbuilt Windoze restore point but that has limitations.


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Re: Desperate
Posted by: guenter
Date: July 13, 2010 06:12AM

Quote
Dara
Good grief! It's been so long since I've used a restore point and I was so frazzled and dumbfounded I couldn't and didn't think to use it. Hopefully, in the future if I need it, I will remember it.

I am still wondering why, when I had K-M installed in its own folder in the program files on my hard drive that it uninstalled others from there, too. However, I guess it's not of much concern any longer as little by little I've been reinstalling some programs and will

just have to learn to live without some others.

My husband wryly said, though I really disagreed with him (because I didn't think I could function without the missing programs), that maybe now my pc will operate more smoothly.

1.) Glad to hear that You found Your ways.

2.) A number of accident reasons possible. Choose Your favorite.
My personal one has been for long: scandisk run for unknown reason.
Usually effects the data I just want to use. grinning smiley

3.) Maybe download the "Opensource DVD". A collection of free programs.

4.) Probably Your PC will for some time till You forget to create backups or restore points and then disaster will strike again. smiling smiley

p.s. I started to backup all really essential data on an USB stick.
I lost it recently with the last real alternative backup more than 5 months old.

I probably will do proper backups for the next year and then get sloppy again. grinning smiley



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/13/2010 06:44AM by guenter.

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Re: Desperate
Posted by: foobarly
Date: July 15, 2010 03:38AM

Just for the record, it's not the first time that a similar problem is reported here. It's been a while but if you search deep enough, I'm sure you'll find other reports here at the forum... IMHO, while something like this remains a possibility, KM should issue a very stern warning about the un/install location.

--- sig ---


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